PPC Origins - Jeannot Delugeau

In episode 43 of the “Getting Granular” podcast, Chris welcomes Jeannot Delugeau, a manager of Paid Search at Granular, to explore his entry and evolution within the PPC industry.

In episode 43 of the “Getting Granular” podcast, Chris welcomes Jeannot Delugeau, a manager of Paid Search at Granular, to explore his entry and evolution within the PPC industry. Jeannot highlights the importance of engaging with diverse client businesses and the need for clear communication. He anticipates further automation in PPC and is optimistic about AI’s role in creative content. Despite platform-driven challenges, Jeannot champions continuous personal and professional growth, illustrating the balance between technology and the human touch in marketing.

Show Notes

Welcome to Getting Granular (00:01): Introduction to the podcast’s focus on digital marketing trends, best practices, and PPC insights.
Host and Guest Introduction (00:25): Chris Caesar, Senior Manager of Paid Media at Granular, introduces guest Jeannot, a Manager of Paid Media.
Jeannot’s Background (00:37): Discussion on Jeannot’s roots, his move to North Carolina, and eventual return to Milwaukee to join Granular.
Entering PPC and Digital Marketing (02:15): Jeannot shares his entry into PPC, highlighting the transition from manual strategies to automation.
Specialization and Client Management at Granular (03:50): Focus on Jeannot’s role in managing client portfolios and his specialization in e-commerce PPC.
Career Journey and PPC Evolution (05:19): Jeannot recounts his career path and observations on the changing landscape of PPC.
Automation’s Impact on PPC (09:52): Discussion on the shift towards automation and machine learning in PPC, and transitioning from Universal Analytics to GA4.
Client Management Philosophy (19:13): Jeannot emphasizes the importance of being proactive, transparent, and adaptable with clients.
Predictions on the Future of PPC (26:02): Insights into the potential for increased automation and AI in PPC, alongside concerns over decreasing manager control.
Personal Growth and Hobbies (33:07): Jeannot talks about the value of continuous improvement and shares his interest in music as a personal growth area.
Closing Thoughts (35:29): Recap of the conversation, appreciation for Jeannot’s insights, and an invitation for listener engagement.

Email us at info@GranularMarketing.com

Follow us on Facebook and Instagram

Episode Transcript

Narrator: Welcome to Getting Granular, the podcast where digital marketing experts from the agency granular talk about the latest trends, tried and true best practices, and share their unfiltered thoughts about the industry. Whether you are here to learn how to grow your business, improve your digital skills, or just want to hear some Midwest PPC experts rant about digital media, you’ve come to the right place.

Chris: Welcome everyone to the Getting Granular podcast. I’m your host, Chris Caesar, senior manager of Paid Media here at Granular, and I am joined today by Geno. Help me out here deluge.

Jeannot: Yep, that’s

Chris: Correct. All right. Got it right, first try, Jano. Welcoming. Glad to have you.

Jeannot: Thanks for having me. So

Chris: This is again, just part of our PPC Origin series or jano. I wouldn’t really call you a new member of the team anymore, but one of the newest members. Are you the newest?

Jeannot: I think me and Lauren and I are pretty much tied. She started technically a week before me. I was just moving across the country to get back to Milwaukee, but yeah, no, we were brought on the team around the same time. She just started a week earlier. So I guess we are the two newest members of the granular team. Alright,

Chris: Well welcome in and we’re glad to have you here. So I guess to kick things off, aside from the fact that like you said, you’re tied for the newest employee here, tell me a little bit about your background.

Jeannot: Yeah, so I grew up in the area. I spent most of my time in Milwaukee. I would say I lived in New Jersey for a little bit for a couple of years during elementary school and then I was technically born in Green Bay, Wisconsin. So I guess I would consider myself local to the area and that was kind of part of the reason why I moved back. Prior to working at Granular, I was living in North Carolina in the research triangle area, which is for those not familiar is for Raleigh, for North Carolina, Durham, and then also Chapel Hill, which is where I was living.

Chris: Interesting. I guess how did you end up in North Carolina? Being from Green Bay and living in Milwaukee,

Jeannot: I just wanted to try a different part of the country and my girlfriend got a job at UNC managing one of the psych labs, and so it was either I moved with and figured things out and got a job out there or I stayed put and I really wanted to try a different part of the country and it seemed like a pretty decent part of the country to try out. I’d never lived in the south technically, and yeah, they had more mild winters, which was cool. It was just cool to see a different subculture, a different part of the us So that was kind of ultimately why I decided to take that leap and move out there and I really enjoyed it, but it didn’t quite feel like home. I had to travel back to the area to visit family when I was taking time off and I had a lot of friends. I had a lot of friends in the area that moved back to Milwaukee, so it just felt like a good time to come back to the area.

Chris: Mild winters. And as we’re recording this, we’ve had the mildest winter basically ever. That’s

Jeannot: True. I was kind of panicked about how my first winter back after three years of being away in the south would be, and honestly I was pleasantly surprised that this one wasn’t that rough.

Chris: So let’s dive a little bit deeper into you and how you work here. So I guess to start off, what is your title? What do you do on a daily basis and

Jeannot: Yeah, I’m a manager of paid media at Granular, so basically managing ads and accounts for a portfolio of clients. So day to day I’m just in their accounts and communicating with the clients, presenting to clients. But yeah, just making sure their accounts are well-managed and that they’re achieving the goals that the clients want.

Chris: What would you say is your specialty? I’m the best at Granular ad this industry, this vertical, this campaign type.

Jeannot: I wouldn’t call myself the best, I wouldn’t call myself the

Chris: Best being so humble,

Jeannot: But at least in terms of prior experience and kind of knowledge of things, my previous role, so the role I worked at in North Carolina was with an agency, kind of similar to Granular but just specializing in Google ads for e-commerce clients. So I would say what I have the most familiarity with and expertise in would be like PPC for e-commerce, but specifically focused on Google ads, but that could be all aspects of Google ads, so search, display, video shopping. That’s where I feel most comfortable so far.

Chris: So walk us through your path to getting at granular. You mentioned you were previously at an agency. What sort of other past experience do you have that sort of brought you down that track to get you here?

Jeannot:How far back are we going?

Chris: Far back as you want to go back?

Jeannot: I mean I feel like most people college and high school worked some service industry jobs to make a little bit of money, a little bit of savings. But in terms of real professional roles, I worked, my first rollout of college, I was a global marketing intern at Manpower Group, so right here in the city that was interesting. They’re a pretty big Fortune 500 company, so it felt a little bit overwhelming almost because it’s just a massive company and you were just another person amongst the team there. So I started to realize I liked maybe smaller mid-size companies, so I definitely learned that at that point in time in terms of culture and fit and then after that, so I worked that for one and a half years. That job was definitely interesting to, it was mostly internal stuff. Since they are such a massive company with branches all across the world, I was mostly helping branches in other countries get the marketing materials they needed and managing some requests for new marketing materials and stuff like that. So that was an interesting role. Then after that, I mean the pandemic happened somewhere in all of that, and then I moved out to North Carolina mid to late pandemic time. And then yeah, I was applying for jobs out there and that’s when I got that marketing agency role and that’s where I really started to cut my teeth in terms of PPC and just get doing a ton of learning and hands-on experience and accounts and just really being really introduced to paid search, paid shopping, all that.

Chris: So I have to ask a question, and this is probably just really more for my own sanity because even though it’s early 2024, 2020 was last year to me and I’m pretty sure a lot of people feel the same way. So let’s take a step back. When you said you spent three years in North Carolina, in my mind you were there pre pandemic, but it sounds like that’s not even close to the case. What were the times and years? What year did you move to North Carolina?

Jeannot: I think I moved out there September, August, 2020. So I guess maybe early pandemic, maybe not mid peak. That’s like peak pandemic. Yeah. Wow. I definitely don’t recommend moving during the pandemic. It’s like a lot of businesses were boarded up and it was just hard to meet people socially. I think the only thing that was going on at your own risk was just pick up soccer. So I was doing that pretty immediately, but otherwise I had to wait for the rest of the social activities to kind of open up based on state laws and policies. So

Chris: All right, let’s hope we don’t need to take that advice into account ever again, that if there’s a pandemic, don’t move across the country

Jeannot: Or do, I mean, I learned a lot and grew a lot as a person.

Chris: All right, but still I don’t want to have another pandemic that was not fun. And Jano will be super humble about this and not tell you this, but I have decided after seeing him play that is the best soccer player in this company by far. It’s not close.

Jeannot: How many people do we have here?

Chris: 24ish

Jeannot: I’ll take that. I’ll take that.

Chris: What if I said seven?

Jeannot: No, you’d

Chris:

Still take it. You still take it.

Jeannot: Yeah, I’ll take that compliment. Yeah, I mean I feel like the best I was at soccer was during that time in North Carolina.

Chris: That’s all you could do.

Jeannot: It was all I could do for a while before things opened up.

Chris: So focusing back on actual page search, I guess, what got you into it? How did you get into it that brought you down this path?

Jeannot: Yeah, my first ever exposure to, besides possibly being served ads that I didn’t realize were ads at that point in time was in my undergraduate studies at UW Madison. I think I was in the business school there and I took a digital marketing course and it covered pretty much everything from how to run an email drip campaign to influencer marketing to of course PPC. And yeah, I just really liked how quickly you could see the results from running advertising. It wasn’t instantaneous, but it was pretty immediate. So unlike SEO where it takes a couple months, maybe even a year to see some real results, I dunno, PPC was pretty immediate and then it was also super measurable. So I thought that was pretty cool. It just kind of clicked for me. So that’s when I first was exposed to PPC and realized that it was something that was pretty interesting to me.

Chris: So then what about it made you want to stick with it as a career choice?

Jeannot: I mean besides the initial fascination with it, I just felt that the initial exposure to it was only scratching the surface. There’s a ton. It was more kind of a crash course and I wanted to get more depth in the field and more expertise. I knew there was a lot more there to be learned. So that made me circle back to it. After pretty much when I moved out to North Carolina, I knew I wanted a medium to smaller sized company and then I knew that this area of marketing interested me. So I kind of spelled out digital marketing agency to me and those were most of the companies I was applying to out there. And then at that same time while I was applying, I was also doing a bootcamp, like a digital marketing bootcamp at UNC Chapel Hill. So obviously all virtual but still interesting. I got a little bit more in depth knowledge of PPC because they went into details a little bit more, but yeah.

Chris: Cool. So when you first got in however many years ago that was, what did the PPC landscape sort of look like?

Jeannot: Yeah, it’s a constantly changing landscape, but when I got into PPC and really got some hands-on experience, it was a much more manual landscape where advertising was more manager controlled rather than machine controlled. So that would be things like a lot of manual bidding. You’d have a campaign with hundreds of different ad groups with all with just one type of keyword in them. You’d have different keyword match types. I think broad match modifier, BMM was a thing back then. ETS were also a thing. So a lot of that’s changed since then. Smart shopping was, which I kind of miss a lot in a lot of ways was a thing as well that has since kind of gone extinct.

Chris: You’re not a big max guy.

Jeannot: I mean I am, but I feel like you don’t really have a choice. True.

Chris: It’s interesting that you mentioned BMM is something that was sway out when you started because talking with people who have, again, may have a few more years experience than both of us when they were part of the original build out of Google ads and search advertising, how that was like, yeah, that was our primary keyword type and now then it sort of moved away to just a secondary thought to now it doesn’t even exist anymore.

Jeannot: I have a vague memory of when I was first getting trained up, it was definitely, I think Google was sending out notifications that it was on its way out. So I think that was roughly when I was really coming into the field.

Chris: Cool. So aside from broad match modified keywords being phased out, how else have you seen things change as you’ve grown and time has passed?

Jeannot: Yeah, it’s changed quite a bit. Obviously it’s just shifted from more kind of tedious media manager controlled kind of setup to just more reliance on automation and just having a lot of those strategies be more dependent on machine learning. So like I was saying earlier where you might’ve had one campaign with a hundred ad groups and different and all those ad groups have one type of keyword for one match type and then you would manually adjust bids for each of those keywords. Now you can kind of lump a bunch of keywords under the same ad group and then apply an automated strategy and have the bidding be adjusted by machine learning. So it’s got its pros and its cons, it’s less time consuming, there’s less human potential for human error. If you’re adjusting a bid, you actually accidentally put in a hundred dollars instead of $1. Not saying that that’s happened to me, but I’ve heard stories

Jeannot: And then it’s less time consuming to manage overall when you’re relying more on automation. But I mean the other side of the coin would be you get a little less visibility into things, less control obviously, and then less of an ability to shake things up immediately. So if you’ve really wanted to get more aggressive on something, if you want to stick with an automated strategy, there’s going to be a learning period, you’re going to adjust the lever that you can adjust and then there’s going to be a learning period for the machine learning to catch up to kind of just learn how that change shakes things up. Whereas before, and you can still do this, you can still do manual bidding, but before you would just crank up the bids and it would be pretty immediate. Also, I was pretty much brought up on universal Analytics and then maybe a year or half a year before joining Granular, that’s when the whole GA four transition went down, which was kind of a chaotic experience, at least the way I perceived it when it was going down. And I’m still not really used to GA four. I feel like the user experience is a lot clunkier, a lot less intuitive than universal Analytics, which I really liked

Chris: And pretty much every other digital marketer there is out there. It’s still a learning curve for pretty much all of us. And just like anything, once you spend more time in it and work through it, you get to get more familiar with the tool. Again, at some point you were never familiar with Google Ads and look at you now, you’re using that every single day, so we’ll get there. You’re not alone on that island of chaos. So transitioning here a little bit, what is it that you like about working in PBC and other paid media?

Jeannot: So at least in an agency setting, I like PPC in an agency setting. I like the ability to learn about various businesses that your clients have and the industries that they’re in. I find that pretty interesting. It never really gets old to try and wrap your head around a different business or a new business models. Some of them are super interesting to me, but more generally, I like the challenge that comes with trying to put yourself in a target audience’s shoes and thinking about what kind of ad would really resonate with them. Headlines, creative call to action, all that is really interesting to me. And then lastly, I really like how dynamic the field is. There’s always something new to learn, something is always changing. Sometimes that can be a little bit daunting, but it keeps things interesting for sure.

Chris: Yeah, I think that you are sort of in the same boat as I am where you could be working on one thing at one point and then 10 minutes later doing something almost completely different and you sort of thrive in that. I don’t know if chaotic environment is the right word, but somewhat chaotic. It can be of jumping from task to task to task and industry to industry to industry almost in an hourly or daily basis,

Jeannot: Right? Yeah, exactly.

Chris: So diving in a little bit more talk about yourself and how you manage accounts, what’s sort of your strategy when it comes to how you run a paid media account? How you work with clients and talking with them about not only their accounts, but then reporting on their analytics and their ROI just a little bit more dive in on how if I were a client signing up and I was assigned to work with you, what can I expect?

Jeannot: That’s a good question. In terms of how I like to work with clients, I think it’s important to be more proactive than reactive. Trying to get in front of the client about things rather than having them check up on how things are going or constantly having to reach out. So that’s definitely one of the keys to success, at least in my mind for working with clients, anticipating maybe concerns or also possible strategies that would be really relevant to the client and just kind of getting out in front of them, communicating on those things before they reach out about it. Another thing would be being transparent and breaking things down and explaining things clearly to a client, especially if things aren’t as they anticipated. I think that’s a major benefit of an agency, a good agency that they can do that for clients. Because a lot of times with these platforms, things are either, I don’t know, really boilerplate and just they don’t give any context, especially with all the machine learning that’s going on and automation, they don’t really provide a bunch of context or some of the things are just harder to wrap your head around.

Jeannot: So just kind of breaking those things down for clients who might not be in the platforms or managing ads all day every day.

Chris: Yeah, I think that boilerplate stuff that you mentioned is also very interesting because again, if you’re just blindly following Google’s, Google’s Opry score, oh, you have a hundred percent, but in reality your account could be running so poorly just if you just blindly accept everything you’re told to do.

Jeannot: Yeah, that’s exactly what I’m talking about. The example of let’s say you’re a business and you’re just working with a Google rep, sometimes it’s pretty confusing and based on what they view as a priority, which might not be the best interest for your business can be a bit misleading sometimes I feel like. And that’s what I think the real value of agencies such as Granular, that’s where I think we come in that. Yeah,

Chris: Definitely. Funny that you mentioned granular. That’s sort of the next topic here to talk through is we sort of already talked about what brought you here. Is there anything else you wanted to add to how you got here? Or if not, you’d just talk about what you’d like about working here?

Jeannot: Yeah, I guess what brought me to Granular, besides knowing that I wanted to continue to gain expertise in the field of PPC and work at a smaller kind of agency style company, I knew that I also wanted to move back to the area, be closer to friends and family. But just weirdly enough, I knew Grant who works here, he does a lot of creative work for the company. Shout out to Grant. Yes, shout out. Grant. If you’re listening,

Chris: Grant will hear this.

Jeannot: So yeah, oddly enough, I knew him from a previous marketing internship who was in the dairy industry. He was a full-time member of the team. I was more of an intern, but we kind of became acquainted through that and he just randomly reached out to me while I was living in North Carolina looking for jobs, mentioning that there was an opening at his current place of employment, so granular. So then I did a bit of research, looked at the role, and after doing all that, I decided that I would throw my hat in the ring because it was just aligned pretty nicely with what I had been doing. My skills and experience. Then also just randomly came into my mind that I had probably walked by the office like 20 times since my dad lives in the area. So I was like, oh yeah, I know. I vaguely know this place.

Chris: I think the one thing that I want to call out is you mentioned you worked in the dairy industry with Grant and when you started you said, yeah, I can get whatever kind of cheeses you guys want, and you’ve been here for almost a year and I still have not seen any cheese.

Jeannot: You saw cheese, you just didn’t get picked at the white elephant to get the cheese.

Chris: Okay. I was correct. I’m just looking. One of these days I want to show up and there’s just a full cheese plate laying out on the counter.

Jeannot: I’m still working on that. There’s a long shipping time from Europe to the us.

Chris: Okay. It’s coming over. Somebody’s swimming with it on their back across the ocean. Is that,

Jeannot: Yep, that’s the most efficient way to get cheese to the

Chris: Us. All right, I’m waiting. I’m still waiting. So aside from the lack of cheese, what else do you enjoy about working here?

Jeannot: Definitely, I don’t want to be cliche, but I definitely really like the people at Granular. Everyone knows their stuff, but they aren’t pretentious about it. They’re willing to take time to sit down with you and share their knowledge and help you learn and just help you level up at whatever it is you’re trying to improve in. So that would be the top thing that comes to mind. I also like how much trust granular places in its employees, just allowing you to manage accounts to a very high standard. I just think that’s neat that you get a lot of autonomy.

Chris: For sure. I noticed disagreements. Those are also things I let it go about working here. So we talked about the past what PVC looked like when you started, how you got here, the present, what you like about working here and whatnot. So the only logical next step is to talk about the future. What do you foresee as the future of PPC? I guess just to start off, what do you see it looking?

Jeannot: Honestly, that’s hard for me to predict. I mean, I definitely see us continuing down the road of automation and maybe with the human role being just overseeing a lot of the lifting that’s been done with automation, which is kind of what we’re doing kind of now, but maybe to an even greater degree in the future. But that’s really hard. I’m not reading up a ton on ai. I need to probably be looking into these things more, but it’s just changing every day. But that’s probably, it’s probably how things are going to start to look, but it’s hard for me to make that call personally. I dunno. What do you think?

Chris: I mean, I was going to say that I think I’m sort of on that same page as you of you could do some reading on AI today and then two days from now what you just learned could be completely irrelevant because it is growing and developing so quickly.

Jeannot: I also think in an agency setting, clients and business owners still really value the human interaction and input and thought process. So I feel like that would be hard to just rip away from someone who runs a business.

Chris: Yeah, definitely. It is really exciting to think about how we can best leverage it, but then also continue to provide that human touch that you’re, you’re going to have someone on your side, you’re going to have someone looking out for your best interests when AI may, it may not. It’s always going to be sort of upper question of is this what’s working best for me? And having someone who’s on top of that topic to know, okay, yes, this is working well for us, or no, it’s not. And if it’s not, how do we pivot to make sure it is

Jeannot: Right?

Chris: It’s exciting to think about, but again, it’s somewhat concerning as well of how it develops and evolves.

Jeannot: It’s hard for me to even imagine because things change so quickly up till now, I think. When did Chad GPT get released and then you started seeing all those, I guess fake videos, but the facial

Chris: Recognition,

Jeannot: Well, that’s not the term I’m looking for, but the CGI for the face and the voice mimicking of ai, that came out pretty instantly after chat GPT was dropped and then you just started seeing that everywhere in terms of social media content, it just has gone really quickly and I feel like it’s only going to continue to evolve very quickly and it’s just hard for me to keep track of it.

Chris: Not to pontificate on this even more when this is pretty much a dead horse that’s been beaten by everybody, but if you took a cell phone back to the 1850s, people would look at what is this crazy technology? And that’s sort of where we’re at with this AI development of if we go forward 150 years in the future, it’s going to be crazy. Insane.

Jeannot: Yeah, that is always funny to try and relativize a current innovation in, I dunno, 18 hundreds terms. What would someone from Victorian England think about this? I dunno, AI chat, GP,

Chris: That’d be witch’s material.

Jeannot: Yeah, that’s true. You have to be careful with ai.

Chris: Cool. Anything else that excites or concerns you about the future of PPC?

Jeannot: I mean, it’s hard for me to predict where it’s going to go, but in terms of what I’m excited about would be just AI creative. I think that would be a really neat feature that’s constantly a bottleneck with a lot of clients. They don’t have in-House Creative, they don’t have creative assets and because of that we’re unable to run certain types of ads or campaigns. So I think that’ll be a really neat feature once it gets ironed out. Right now, from what I’ve seen, the quality really isn’t there. A lot of the AI generated creative is like looks a little weird or fake or just off, but maybe I don’t have access to the latest and greatest AI tools. But I think that could be really, really neat to have just an AI generated image, commercial image or video. I don’t think AI will ever fully replace it could, I don’t know, but I feel like it would be hard for it to replace creative. In terms of artistic speaking artistically, I feel like there’s always going to be some room for human art and stuff, I think. But in terms of a commercial image or something just for promoting a company, I think that could be cool. You haven’t seen the video of, it’s like a Pizza Hut commercial created by ai.

Chris: I might have because I was going to ask or

Jeannot: A Bud Light commercial?

Chris: No. Do those exist?

Jeannot: Yeah, there were people who were testing out AI creative and they did, I think the prompt was create a Pizza Hut commercial or something. I don’t know if we’re able to mention Pizza Hut on the air, but go for it. Just watching that video, it was just kind of really like what I was talking about. It’s not quite there yet. The images were really, or the video was really off and looked robotic and weird and stuff based on how AI was interpreting that prompt.

Chris: Interesting. I guess aside from ai, anything else that you’re concerned about?

Jeannot: I guess one thing that’s a concern is how some of the platforms are taking away a lot of the control and visibility that media managers have. I don’t know if you agree with that.

Chris: Oh, for sure.

Jeannot: And they’re doing it in the best interest of their platform, but it’s not always the best interest of our clients or our role. So that’s something that is a little concerning. I mean, just a couple weeks ago, I think the report section was just kind of swept away into a different part of the interface in Google ads. I mean, it’s still there, but it’s just not as visible as before. I think personally.

Chris: Yeah, definitely. I would a hundred percent agree with that. So then as we start to wrap up things here, one thing I always like to ask everyone as we close is if you had any words of wisdom that you wanted to share with anybody who has now made it this far into the podcast,

Jeannot: If you’re still with us.

Chris: Thank you.

Jeannot: Thank you. Nothing really. I mean just I think vouching for continuous improvement. I think that’s kind of an idea that I’m a fan of. Just that there’s always something more you can learn or you can always improve in some way and just learning from past experience to just improve constantly. And some learnings might come from unexpected situations like moving halfway across the country. So just generally vouching for that. But other than that, nothing else

Chris: On the topic of continuous improvement. Another fun fact that you wouldn’t voluntarily share with you normally is he is also not only the best soccer player on the team, but he’s also the most accomplished musician on the team. Really. I mean, I’m pretty sure How many instruments do you play now?

Jeannot: One.

Chris: Oh, I thought it was three or four, so maybe

Jeannot: Not. It’s one that can have a ton of different sounds, so it could sound like a guitar,

Chris: Just

Jeannot: Like keyboard synthesizer.

Chris: You play garage band on your iPad.

Jeannot: That’s kind of fun. Not going to lie. No, I don’t own an iPad. I don’t think I’ve ever owned an iPad.

Chris: I mean, me neither. That’s

Jeannot: Why I exclude tablets. I put a negative 100% bit adjustment on tablets.

Chris: Oh, so you only played one instrument?

Jeannot: Yeah, I took piano lessons when I was younger and then a ton of people quit during middle school or high school. I dunno. I wanted to do things socially with my friends and not be at home trying to learn scales and notes, but then I kind of picked it back up during, during the lockdown.

Chris: Sure. Okay. All, well, I guess I’m learning something new about Geno too, because

Jeannot: One instrument, I’m trying to play it well eventually. So that’s what I’ve been focusing on.

Chris: You’re more accomplished than I’m, I’ll tell you that much.

Jeannot: Thank you, Chris.

Chris: All right, thanks for joining us today. Glad you took the time to talk through this. And yeah, hopefully we have you back sometime soon to about the latest developing trends that you’re on top of in the industry. Yeah. Thanks for having me. And thank you all for listening to the Getting granular podcast. Be sure to like and subscribe so you don’t miss out on any PPC tips, tricks, or news in the digital marketing world. We’d love to hear some comments too. If there’s anything that you wanted to hear PVC experts in the industry talk through, we’re always open to feedback. Otherwise, just be sure to visit our website for more content. I’ve been your host, Chris Caesar. Thanks for getting granular with us today.